ST Report: 19-Feb-93 #908
From: Bruce D. Nelson (aa789@cleveland.Freenet.Edu)
Date: 02/22/93-10:47:17 AM Z
From: aa789@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Bruce D. Nelson)
Subject: ST Report: 19-Feb-93 #908
Date: Mon Feb 22 10:47:17 1993
*---== STReport International Online Magazine ==---*
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
"The Original 16/32bit Online Magazine"
from
STR Publishing
""""""""""""""
February 19, 1993 No.9.08
==========================================================================
STReport International Online Magazine
Post Office Box 6672
Jacksonville, Florida
32205 ~ 6672
R.F. Mariano
Publisher - Editor
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_____________________________________________________________________
> 02/19/93 STR 908 "The Original * Independent * Online Magazine!"
""""""""""""""""
- The Editor's Desk - CPU Report - PORTFOLIO NEWS
- TOS 2/3.06 Hints - KC SHOW UPDATE - GEMULATOR 2.1 NEW!
- NVN NEWS & UPDATES - EXCLUSIVE?!? - DELPHI & ATARI!
-* COMPUSERVE SLASHES RATES! *-
-* APPLE OFFERS IBM CONNECTION *-
-* FALCONS IN TWO WEEKS!?! *-
==========================================================================
STReport International Online Magazine
The Original * Independent * Online Magazine
-* FEATURING WEEKLY *-
"Accurate UP-TO-DATE News and Information"
Current Events, Original Articles, Tips, Rumors, and Information
Hardware - Software - Corporate - R & D - Imports
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STReport's BBS, The Bounty, invites BBS systems, worldwide, to participate
in the Fido/NEST/Atari F-Net Mail Network. You may also call our BBS
direct at 904-786-4176, and enjoy the excitement of exchanging information
relative to all computers, worldwide, through the use of excellent
International Networking Systems. SysOps, worldwide, are quite welcome to
join the STReport International Conferences. The Crossnet Code is #34813,
and the "Lead Node" is # 350. All BBS systems are welcome and invited to
actively participate. Support your favorite computers; Join Today!
==========================================================================
CIS ~ DELPHI ~ BIX ~ NVN ~ GENIE ~ FIDO ~ FNET ~ NEST
EURONET ~ CIX ~ CLEVELAND FREE-NET ~ INTERNET
==========================================================================
=============
* ATARI EDITION *
=============
COMPUSERVE WILL PRESENT $15.00 WORTH OF COMPLIMENTARY ONLINE TIME
to the Readers of;
ST REPORT INTERNATIONAL ONLINE MAGAZINE
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
"The Original 16/32bit Online Magazine"
NEW USERS; SIGN UP TODAY!
CALL: 1-800-848-8199 .. Ask for operator 198
You will receive your complimentary time
and
be online in no time at all!
WHAT'S NEW IN THE ATARI FORUMS (February 19)
COMPUSERVE LOWERS ITS CONNECT-TIME RATES
CompuServe Incorporated announced that it is reducing hourly connect-time
charges for members who participate in its Standard Pricing Plan for the
CompuServe Information Service. Connect-time charges will drop as much as
37.5 pct for most CompuServe services, including its popular forums,
beginning Feb 28.
Under the Standard Pricing Plan, members will now pay a monthly fee of
$8.95 for unlimited connect-time use of 36 basic services, such as travel,
shopping, investment and games. When using CompuServe's other services,
members will pay an hourly charge of $8.00 for access at 1200 or 2400 bits
per second and $16.00 for 9600 bits per second access.
Previously, members paid a monthly fee of $7.95 and hourly charges of
$12.80 and $22.80 for access at 1200/2400 and 9600 bits per second,
respectively.
NEW FORUM SOFTWARE
The long awaited new Forum Software has been installed in all of the Atari
Forums! Among other things, this allows longer messages and improvements
in sending CompuServe Mail from within the forum. Some old commands have
been dropped, and a couple of commands work slightly differently than they
used to.
Please see the file MSGFEA.DOC in LIB 1 of the Atari Arts Forum (GO
ATARIARTS) for details on the changes. Don't hesitate to leave a note to
SYSOP if you have any questions.
NEW CENTIPEDE GAME FROM SCOTLAND!
Download file CENTPD.LZH from LIBRARY 2 of the Atari Arts Forum (GO
ATARIARTS) for an excellent shareware version of Centipede from Scotland.
This game is FULL of bugs (Spiders, Flies and of course, Centipedes!)
Great sound, great graphics, great fun! COLOR ONLY.
RTS/CTS FLOW CONTROL FIX
Download file SERFX2.LZH from LIBRARY 2 of the Atari Productivity Forum
(GO ATARIPRO) for Serial Fix 2 - RTS/CTS flow control with any TOS. This
patch for properly handling RTS/CTS flow control in the ST's serial port
works on all TOS versions from 1.00 to 4.01. It also includes the
TOS14FIX.PRG code for TOS 1.04 and 1.06 users. Use with Atari's
eXtensible Control Panel (XCONTROL).
SCREEN SAVERS
Download file SAVER1.LZH from LIBRARY 4 of the Atari Productivity Forum
(GO ATARIPRO) for a package of 6 shareware screensaver modules for Warp 9,
by John Dillenburg. Modules included are Freckles, Pyro Deluxe, Random
Lines, Roaming Shapes, Random Shapes, and Fractal Symmetries.
LASERJET 4 DRIVER FOR PAGESTREAM 2!
Download file NEWPRT.LZH from LIBRARY 11 of the Atari Vendors Forum (GO
ATARIVEN) for the New HP LaserJet 4, HP DeskJet 550c, HP DeskJet 500c, and
PostScript printer drivers for Pagestream 2.
THE ATARI PORTFOLIO FORUM ON COMPUSERVE
HAS BEEN DESIGNATED AN
OFFICIAL SUPPORT SITE BY ATARI CORPORATION
"GO APORTFOLIO TO ACCESS THE ATARI PORTFOLIO FORUM"
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
> From the Editor's Desk "Saying it like it is!"
""""""""""""""""""""""
STReport was informed upsetting contacts were sent to the other major
services about last week's issue (STR907) because we overlooked giving
credit to a certain RT for a few messages we re-printed from that RT.
This was an honest oversight, a simple mistake. For the last 2-3 hundred
issues of STReport we've diligently attempted to ensure proper credits and
by-lines were provided for the items appearing in our humble offerings.
The main area we focused upon was the reprints of messages from the online
services. After all, we feel that if that's where the action is.. then it
stands to reason the readers deserve to know this. The very best manner
in which to make sure they do is to give proper credit to the service the
message traffic came from. Rest assured, all credits will be given and
special attention will be given to making sure this never happens again in
the future.
These are amazing times. The Falcon's arrival around March first is
supposed to be a done thing, yet there is still no mention of an interface
that will allow current, loyal Atari SLM Laser printer owners to use their
Laser Printers with new Falcon. Also, why haven't we heard anything about
the "alleged overheating and case bulge" observations? Could they
possibly be 'too hot to handle'?
Odd... these pertinent points of information seemingly are left
unattended by the minister of information but other _less than accurate_
tidbits appear to be the main focus of his full attention. Who was it
that said they don't play the vendetta game? It sure looks that way.
Also odd are the copious amounts of time devoted to political projects
that are apparently not connected with the release of the Falcon or the
positive growth of Atari. Time will undoubtedly prove the extracurricular
activities of the "beloved" propaganda chief were not in his or Atari's
best interests.
In the last few weeks, an apparent campaign to "silence" STReport has
been pursued rather diligently on more than one front. Amazing that all
these "actions" are on the heels of each other. In any case, STReport
will be here with regularity telling it like it is. We shall persevere
and withstand this latest onslaught of those whose sole desire it is to
silence STReport.
It must be repeated many times over and repeated it will be.
STReport's staff and publisher are not "down" on Atari hardware. We _are_
highly suspicious of certain actions of its leadership and their
designates. Especially the perceived politics, head games and ego trips.
There is no place for this sort of thing on this platform at this time.
The best thing we all can do is work together to encourage Atari's
leaders to concentrate on the growth factor and marketshare. Atari is
spending far too much time playing games with the userbase.
Another festering sore blemishing Atari's customer relations image is
this business of "exclusives". This is a major, major _ public relations
blunder_. It must be avoided above all else. The main reason is the
indirect message it sends to Atari's loyal users on all the major services
and that appears to be that "if you ain't where Atari is... you ain't
there"! Or, in plainer language, go where Atari wants you to go .... else
you receive less than average online support regardless of the fact you
_paid the asking price_ for your computer and software. This is a plain
and simple slap in the face to every user who must wait for the "cash cow"
to be milked by Atari.
One day... maybe just maybe... there'll be more than enough machines
being sold to keep everyone busy. In so doing, the sniping and backbiting
will be a thing of the past.
Ralph @ STReport International Online Magazine
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
STReport's Staff DEDICATED TO SERVING YOU!
""""""""""""""""
Publisher - Editor
""""""""""""""""""
Ralph F. Mariano
PC DIVISION AMIGA DIVISION MAC DIVISION
----------- -------------- ------------
Roger D. Stevens Charles Hill R. ALBRITTON
STReport Staff Editors:
"""""""""""""""""""""""
Dana P. Jacobson Michael Arthur John Deegan
Lucien Oppler Brad Martin Judith Hamner
John Szczepanik Dan Stidham Joseph Mirando
Steve Spivey Doyle C. Helms
Lloyd E. Pulley, Editor Emeritus
Contributing Correspondents:
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
Michael Lee Richard Covert Scott Birch
Brian Converse Oliver Steinmeier Tim Holt
Andrew Learner Norman Boucher Harry Steele
Clemens Chin Neil Bradley Eric Jerue
Ron Deal Robert Dean Ed Westhusing
James Nolan Vernon W. Smith Bruno Puglia
IMPORTANT NOTICE
""""""""""""""""
Please, submit letters to the editor, articles, reviews, etc...
via E-Mail to:
Compuserve.................... 70007,4454
Delphi........................ RMARIANO
BIX........................... RMARIANO
FIDONET....................... 112/35
FNET.......................... NODE 350
NEST.......................... 90:21/350.0
GEnie......................... ST-REPORT
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STR'S "BELIEVE IT? OR.. WHAT?"
<>###############################<>
"There is no comparison! The Atari Falcon
is far superior to the PC platform."
Sam Tramiel, 08/92
"My new office, which has a better view than my old one, is so far
quite satisfactory. And Richard Miller is in my old office. The
Forbes article was a mish-mash and misconstrued article full of half
truths. We are anxiously awaiting the release of the Atari Falcon to
bring us back to the forefront. The article has given us some laughs,
but otherwise has not affected us."
Sam Tramiel, 08/92
"As I said before, all marketing announcements will be made at
Duesseldorf. I will not comment on future models of the Falcon.
WE ARE TALKING TODAY ABOUT A MACHINE.....
WHICH WILL BE SHIPPING NEXT WEEK."
Sam Tramiel, 08/92
"I've just returned from Asia, where I saw the first Atari Falcon
production coming off the lines. Let's hope this new offering will
make it in North America. I know that the specs are great."
Sam Tramiel, 08/92
"We have not yet even given the machine to the FCC. And we are only
applying for Class B approval. According to our "experts", it should
pass Class B."
Sam Tramiel, 08/92
"...... We are not working for Wall Street but to
make money for our shareholders and only think long term."
Sam Tramiel, 11/92
psssst.
FYI.... The Shareholder's equity is fine.... NOT!
The Stock is hovering around $1.12
CHRISTMAS '92 has COME and GONE...
FALCONS ....anyone?
By the Way.... Does the Falcon work well
with
any... of the SLM Laser Printers?? NOPE! NOT YET!
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> CPU STATUS REPORT LATE BREAKING INDUSTRY-WIDE NEWS
=================
Computer Products Update - CPU Report
------------------------ ----------
Weekly Happenings in the Computer World
Issue #08
By: John Deegan
APPLE OFFERS IBM CONNECTION - Apple Computer Inc. this week unveiled
its SNA.ps 5250 emulator software package that allows Macintosh users to
access applications on IBM's Application System/400 computers.
Apple officials as saying the software package also will be the first
Apple product developed under the Apple/IBM enterprise networking initi-
ative and sold both by Apple and IBM. The package is set to be available
in June at a retail price of $345.
STEVE CHEN PLANNING TO RE-ENTER WITH NEW SUPERCOMPUTER VENTURE - Days
after abandoning efforts to keep his company, Supercomputers Systems
Inc., alive, Steve Chen and former employees are back with a new idea.
Chen's new company, called SuperComputers International, will draw on
some of the potential investors they located while trying to save SSI in
their continuing efforts to create the world's fastest computer.
A prototype of Chen's SS-1 was built and operating and employees
claimed it could perform 51.2 billion calculations per second, three
times more than the top machine on the market.
SEAGATE PROVIDES MOTOROLA WITH 1GB HARD DRIVES - Seagate Technology
says it's shipping the Motorola Computer Group volume quantities of its
1.2GB 3.5-inch hard drive, the ST11200N.
The ST11200N's Fast SCSI-2 interface and 5,400 RPM spindle motor pro-
vide a 10MB per second data transfer rate and sustainable I/O transfer
rate of more than 4MB per second. The drive also features a 256K cache
and an mean time between failure (MTBF) specification of 200,000 hours.
MOTOROLA UNVEILS 1-WAY MODEM AS CREDIT CARD-SIZED DATA RECEIVER - A
credit card-sized wireless receiver called NewsCard has been unveiled by
Motorola Inc., which says the device can store information and transfer
it to the new palm-sized computers and personal communicators.
The $339 card, which incorporates a one-way modem and a 128K of mem-
ory, "automatically can receive and store information such as electronic
mail, stock quotes, news updates and data files."
Motorola officials said a user transfers the information by inserting
the card into an external slot on the PCs and personal communicators.
The company plans to begin shipping NewsCard in the second quarter, when
the new portable computing devices become available.
HITACHI MEMORY CHIP BREAKTHROUGH - Hitachi Europe Ltd., has announced
a breakthrough that could lead to new memory chips with a vastly
increased capacity, but which would draw no more power than present-day
micro-chips. A number of Hitachi-sponsored scientists and British
researchers have been working on an advanced memory chip since 1989.
Present RAM, or even more expensive but lower-power CMOS (compliment-
ary metal-oxide semiconductors) memory, would draw many amps to power a
1,000 gigabyte (GB) memory, far more than is practical for any portable
or even most desktop computers. However, the newly developed "single-
electron" memory would not only occupy about 100,000 times less space
than conventional memory, it would also draw proportionally less power,
making massive memories practical for even PCs.
If such memory became possible to mass produce at reasonable costs,
it could eventually lead to a surge in interest in drive- less computers
which depend on high-speed memory to store information in RAM disks.
Such computers are now in use and in the past, when hard drives were
expensive and slow, RAM disks were very popular. However, the cost and
power demands of memories running into the hundreds of megabytes are not
currently practical for most applications.
As microprocessors increase in power, they place ever greater demands
on data transfer rates and memory size, leading to an ever increasing
requirement for massive and inexpensive memories. This latest develop-
ment shows one way in which companies could meet the demands.
ROBODOC INVENTER DEAD AT 59 - The 59-year-old veterinarian who in-
vented the Robodoc, a robotic arm to help doctors in surgery, has died
of leukemia. He passed away at Stanford University Hospital in
California.
Howard Paul intended his Robodoc to help in human surgery in such
areas as knee replacements, ligament repairs and the removal of brain
tumors.
Robodoc is a five-foot arm with a high-speed drill and computer tech-
nology designed to provide greater accuracy than a doctor's hands. It
was used for the first time in human surgery in a hip replacement in
November.
SURVEY SAYS GUI'S EXPENSIVE BUT WORTH IT - A survey carried out by
the Microcomputer Management Association (MMA) says that the real cost
of moving to a graphical user interface (GUI) is high, but is worth it
in the long run.
In a survey of 402 corporate information technology managers, the MMA
claims that it costs $3,600 per user to move to Windows on average. How-
ever, of those surveyed, the majority said the move was a strategic one
to make their company more competitive in the marketplace. Also, the
survey results offered evidence that increased productivity is offset-
ting the cost of the move over time.
Of the various graphical user interfaces on the market, the MMA said
that the usage of OS/2 2.0 is expected to increase. Apple Macintosh use
is expected to decrease, however. Mac users surveyed said they were ext-
remely satisfied with their operating system, but that they didn't see
Macintoshes as playing an important part of their organization. However,
the number of reduced instruction set computing (RISC) computers and
Unix- based machines are expected to increase slightly.
Microsoft Windows is the predominant GUI implemented in corporate en-
vironments, despite the fact that most of those surveyed were IBM per-
sonal computer users. Corporate America is expected to implement faster,
more powerful personal computers, replacing 286-based PCs. While 386-
based PCs will remain in use, the survey said 486-based PCs are expected
to become predominant in the next 12 months.
SURVEY SAYS COMPUTER LIT LAGS - A survey of 1,481 management informa-
tion systems executives finds that, while three out of four believe
workers' computer literacy has a major impact on company operations,
most do not offer continuous training opportunities or even testing.
Also, only 34% conduct hands-on exercises during pre- screening to
determine the computer skills of job candidates. Instead, most -- 66%,
according to the survey -- still rely on candidates' statements on
applications or during interviews.
CIS LOWERS RATES - CompuServe has improved its Standard Pricing Plan
to lower online connect time charges for its subscribers effective Feb.
28.
The monthly membership fee for unlimited use of more than 30 basic
services has been raised $1 to $8.95, but the hourly connect rate for
extended services, including forums, reference databases and multiplayer
games, has been significantly reduced -- as much as 37.5% less when con-
necting at 1200 or 2400 baud.
The new rates allow subscribers under the Standard Pricing Plan to
use CompuServe's extended services for an hourly connect rate of $6 at
300 baud, $8 at 1200 and 2400 baud, and $16 at 9600 baud.
AMERIBOARD LISTS THOUSANDS OF US BBS NUMBERS - DP McIntyre, operator
of the Ameriboard BBS at 412-349-6862, is rapidly building a massive
database of bulletin board systems (BBS) based in the United States and
he has made this monthly bulletin available free of charge for all BBS
users and for posting on other systems.
As far as known, this is currently the only national general interest
BBS list being maintained in the US. McIntyre said that he will also
build and make available "MISL," an international BBS list sometime
later this year.
__________________________________________________________________
> CIS LOWERS RATES! STR Spotlight GOOD NEWS FOR COMPUTER ENTHUSIASTS
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
COMPUSERVE LOWERS RATES
=======================
(Feb. 16)
CompuServe has improved its Standard Pricing Plan to lower online
connect time charges for its subscribers effective Feb. 28.
The monthly membership fee for unlimited use of more than 30 basic
services has been raised $1 to $8.95, but the hourly connect rate for
extended services, including forums, reference databases and multiplayer
games, has been significantly reduced -- as much as 37.5 percent less when
connecting at 1200 or 2400 baud.
The new rates allow subscribers under the Standard Pricing Plan to use
CompuServe's extended services for an hourly connect rate of $6 at 300
baud, $8 at 1200 and 2400 baud, and $16 at 9600 baud.
Those who prefer the Alternative Pricing Plan will pay a monthly rate
of $2.50 plus an hourly rate of $6.30 for 300 baud, $12.80 for 1200 and
2400 baud, and $22.80 for 9600 baud. However, switching plans could result
in significant savings even if you are online as little as two hours each
month.
Some of the more than 30 basic services that carry no connect time
charges under the Standard Pricing Plan are Associated Press Online,
Accu-Weather Maps/Reports, UK News Clips, Grolier's Academic American
Encyclopedia, Consumer Reports, HealthNet, The Electronic Mall, Basic
Current Stock Quotes, Travelshopper, CompuServe Mail and Directory of
Members.
--Cathryn Conroy
To Everyone:
I am pleased (thrilled) to announce that CompuServe is reducing the
hourly connect rates for subscribers to its BASIC SERVICES plan. Connect
rates for these subscribers will drop as much as 37% for most of
CompuServe's services, including this forum effective Feb 28.
Under the Standard Pricing Plan, members will now pay a monthly fee of
$8.95 for unlimited connect-time use of 36 basic services, such as travel,
shopping, investment and games. When using CompuServe's other services,
members will pay an hourly charge of $8.00 for access at 1200 or 2400 bits
per second and $16.00 for 9600 bits per second access.
Previously, members paid a monthly fee of $7.95 and hourly charges of
$12.80 and $22.80 for access at 1200/2400 and 9600 bits per second,
respectively.
As per previous policy, the BASIC SERVICES plan is not mandatory for
members, but I think you can easily calculate that these new lower rates
will make it more advantageous for you to switch over to this new pricing
structure.
We expect that user activities in this forum will pick up with the new
lower prices and CompuServe's resource management department has promised
to keep an eye on things to handle the increased load on the mainframes.
If you have any questions about the new pricing option, please don't
hesitate to ask the sysops.
Ron Luks
Forum Manager
With this news the users speak up on CIS in the Atari Fora;
#: 37271 S14/ST REPORT
17-Feb-93 00:58:34
Sb: #37261-Inaccurate Reporting
Fm: carl barron 75066,3204
To: SYSOP*Ron Luks 76703,254
Very interesting!!
Takes the wind out of a few sails, doesn't it?
Can you(or someone else be more specific as to which court cases
determine subscription telecom. networks not to be common carriers, and
which specifically designates them as a newsstand. Thank you... Email is
fine if need be....
With these prices and software differences, genie will not be the
cheapest even at 2400. Its software response is much slower... 9600 is no
contest. CIS WINS that one without any fight, even at Jan.1. prices.
#: 37262 S14/ST REPORT
16-Feb-93 16:42:18
Sb: #37228-Inaccurate Reporting
Fm: SYSOP*Ron Luks 76703,254
To: Greg Wageman 74016,352
No, calling GEnie the discount service is no longer as applicable now
that CIS (just this morning) has announced the details of its rate cut
(up to 37%) for subscribers of its BASIC SERVICES.
If you haven't already read the details, I'll be posting them very
shortly.
Ron
#: 81100 S17/Community Square
17-Feb-93 03:50:34
Sb: #81059-News
Fm: Domingo B. Alvear 74030,3254
To: Jim Ness 75300,3155
Jim,
That looks VERY promising! So for $8.95 I can have all the mail and other
stuff I want? And I don't get charged extra for 9600 baud? So the ONLY
time I get charged is when I am using the Atari Forums? Is this TRUE? I
was considering just sticking with the 'Alternate' plan, but this looks
VERY good.
And now mail won't cost extra.
Dom
#: 37283 S8/Hot Topics
17-Feb-93 12:30:21
Sb: #37271-#Pricing
Fm: Sysop*Brad Hill 75720,540
To: carl barron 75066,3204 (X)
Carl,
Genie will still be cheaper at certain hours of the day for 2400
access. But on average, CIS is now _less_ expensive, and is definitely
less expensive at any hour for 9600 access.
Last time I was on Genie I was finger-tappingly amazed at how slow it
was.
-- Brad
#: 37286 S8/Hot Topics
17-Feb-93 13:43:24
Sb: #37283-#Pricing
Fm: SYSOP*Ron Luks 76703,254
To: Sysop*Brad Hill 75720,540 (X)
Its important to remember that the raw dollar/hour rate isn't as important
as the calculation of bytes transmitted per dollar. If you get much
faster thruput on CIS, a slightly higher dollar/hour rate can still be
more cost effective.
#: 37300 S8/Hot Topics
17-Feb-93 23:05:34
Sb: #37286-#Pricing
Fm: Sysop*Brad Hill 75720,540
To: SYSOP*Ron Luks 76703,254 (X)
Ron and BobR,
You're both right about "real" cost-effectiveness.
When I first came online, I had accounts both here and with Genie, and
it took me exactly one month to dump Genie. Explaining the move to
friends and family (who of course are all INTENSELY interested in my
every decision), I elucidated that CIs was twice as expensive, twice as
good, and twice as fast. So at the time it seemed that I was paying the
same amount, effectively, for a better universe. now, with these rates,
there's no justifiable comparison between the two at all (showing my
competitive nature, here).
The February issue of PC Magazine has a comparative survey of online
services, and CIS is the Editor's Choice... and that's at the OLD rates!
They mention impending decreases, but don't give specifics. So I think
we can expect to continue to enjoy increased traffic across the boards of
this particular universe....
-- Brad
#: 37299 S14/ST REPORT
17-Feb-93 22:36:07
Sb: #37285-#LOWER RATES
Fm: carl barron 75066,3204
To: SYSOP*Ron Luks 76703,254 (X)
Funny this 'Atari customer' has been here longer than Tramiel's have
been with atari. <grin>. If genie is so 'cheap' why are the 'bills' I
get awfully close to one another on a monthly basis now. You guys can
lower the price here all you want <grin> but don't dispose of the
features of getting from one place to another in warp (compared to them.)
times...
#: 37316 S14/ST REPORT
18-Feb-93 12:42:31
Sb: #37299-#LOWER RATES
Fm: SYSOP*Ron Luks 76703,254
To: carl barron 75066,3204 (X)
The only thing going down is the cost of our service-- not the
quality. Give us a couple of days when the new rates go into effect to
effectively re-balance the system but after that, I'm sure you'll approve.
In addition to new, lower rates, we are still improving the forum
software, too. Besides the new bigger 10k messages you see here, we'll
be adding more features and increasing the sizes of our forums later this
spring/early summer.
#: 37317 S14/ST REPORT
18-Feb-93 12:52:44
Sb: #37316-#LOWER RATES
Fm: Atari Explorer mag - AEO 70007,3615
To: SYSOP*Ron Luks 76703,254 (X)
When you say increasing the size of your forums are you talking about
message categories (about 18 is the limit currently) and file areas which
are about the same size also?
-- Albert Dayes @ Atari Explorer magazine
#: 37332 S14/ST REPORT
19-Feb-93 14:29:44
Sb: #37317-LOWER RATES
Fm: SYSOP*Ron Luks 76703,254
To: Atari Explorer mag - AEO 70007,3615 (X)
YEs, thats what I'm talking about.
________________________________________________________________
> ONLINE WEEKLY STReport OnLine The wires are a hummin'!
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
PEOPLE... ARE TALKING
=====================
On CompuServe
-------------
compiled by Joe Mirando
73637,2262
Hidi-ho good neighbors and neighborettes! You guessed it: I've been
watching "HOME IMPROVEMENT" again (grunt, grunt). Just think of me as
"that guy behind the fence with the funny hat"... No, wait a minute. The
guy behind the fence always has a solution for his neighbor's problem, so
I guess that the part should go to Albert Dayes. Well, at any rate, I'm
back again and ready to bring you the questions and answers that you've
been laying awake at night thinking about... well, okay, maybe not. Read
on, and see if you find anything of interest.
From The Atari Productivity Forum
=================================
A cute note to John Amsler from Hal Dougherty:
"John,
\\__________mmmmmmmm______ ______mmmmmmmm__________//
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//////////////////////////\\\///\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
/////////////// \\// \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
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/|\ /|\
THE FALCON030 IS COMING!
Keep the faith!"
On the subject of the number of people using CompuServe, Mike Mortilla
posts:
"As a "regular" it would seem that there is an increase in activity. I
would imagine that Ron could hit a few keys and find out exactly what
the increase was.
I've also noticed more User IDs as well as increased activity, not
just the same members leaving more messages <g>."
Forum manager (a fancy way of saying "Chief Sysop"), Ron Luks answers:
"Yeah, our activity is up 'significantly' in the past 2 months, but
CIS wont let me release exact specifics. I can only say that activity
is up across the boards from more than just the USA and more than a
small group of members. When the new rates kick into effect on Feb
28, it should get even busier."
Dazzz Smith adds:
"It has certainly increased in the past week or so, but prior to that
I thought it had just dipped below the previous levels, rather than
climbing from the normal levels."
On the subject of standardizing programs Michael Smith tells Brian Gockley
of ST Informer:
"What WOULD be nice is if Atari laid out some rules for developers and
everyone followed those rules, such as:
Everyone supports the Atari Clipboard Everyone decide how to exit a
program (ALT Q, ALT X, CTRL Q, etc) so that from one application to
another, things are fairly consistent.
Everyone follows the same rules on sounds: Gemsound is a great
program, but with so many different events, you really don't know when
a sound is going to pop up. Sometimes window_open and window_close
are similar to other events so when certain windows are open if you
have as sound assigned to window_open, nothing happens.
Sure, this may be in the wrong area, but I thought I'd take off on
your request.
We've got the best hardware and a great op system (a little faster and
less overhead than Macintosh) but if you'll notice Apple laid down a
few ground rules and since then, nearly all Mac applications work in
harmony with each other."
Alex Kiernan replies to Michael about standardization:
"But they have, see the Falcon Dev docs."
Brian adds another facet to the "gem":
"Agreed, standards can be a real boon to the user, though at times a
drag on evolution. What my standards are might also not be someone
else's favorite, but I think I could learn to live with that."
Beth Jane Freeman gives us the benefits of her "exploration" of TOS 2.06
INF files:
"I've been fiddling around with the desktop under TOS 2.06. To make a
long story short, I crashed the computer. However, I learned some
interesting things in the course getting the computer back to the way
things were.
First of all, if you're going to edit the icons or the NEWDESK.INF
file, make a back up copy of each file.
If you decide to use different icons for the folders, drives, and
trashcan icons on desktop, there is a very economical way to do it.
The HEX numbers are as follows
00 floppy disk drive
01 folder
02 trash can
03 program
04 text file (anything that's not executable)
Replace each icon with your customized icon, keeping them in the same
order as the original ones. If you are using ICON JUGGLE (hat tip to
Charles Johnson, it's inventor), run the computer without NEWDESK.INF
and DESKICON.RSC. This will bring the default icons into ICON JUGGLE.
Append your custom icon file to this, and move your icons into the
appropriate places (setting the controls to show the HEX numbers for
each icon). Now, when you save this file as DESKICON.RSC and save the
desktop, your floppy drives, trash can, folders, program files, and
non program files will be set the way you want it. This saves a lot
of space in the NEWDESK.INF file, and saves you lots of time setting
things up. Before you leave ICON JUGGLE, write down the HEX numbers
for each icon in the file. You'll need this later.
When you want to customize icons for particular programs, or groups of
similar files, use the "Install Icon" from the drop down menu on
desktop. However, when there's a group of related files (like
pictures, resource files, or spreadsheets), don't highlight one or
more of the icons in the group. Go directly to the Install Icon menu
and use wildcard to indicate the kind of file. Select the icon, and
click on "Install." This is much shorter and keeps the NEWDESK.INF
file shorter.
You can also directly edit NEWDESK.INF. That is where the list of HEX
numbers comes in. You can add more icons (or delete some you
installed by mistake) by editing the NEWDESK.INF file. First you need
a word processor (or text editor) that allows you to save ASCII files
(or text). Set the margins for Left 0, Right 80, and Top 0. When you
compare the list of icons to the listings in NEWDESK, you'll see which
icons go with which sets of files or folders. "#I" at the beginning
of a line indicates a file icon, and "#D" indicates a folder. Just
make sure that you copy each new line exactly the way the existing
ones are done, using all symbols and spaces. DO NOT delete any of the
information at the top of the file. All of this tells the computer
where to put the icons, what color to make the screen, and how the
control panel is set up. You do have to be careful not to make
NEWDESK.INF too long, or it won't work the way you want it to. I just
have yet to figure out how many lines are too many.
In the meantime, have fun, but be sure to save your original
NEWDESK.INF and DESKICON.RSC in case anything goes wrong."
Sysop Bob Retelle gives Beth some much-earned praise:
"Beth... that's pretty terrific information about Newdesk Icons..!
Would you mind if I copied your message into the Software Libraries so
we can keep a permanent copy of it..? I'm sure a lot of people could
benefit from your experiences, and your extremely clear
directions...!"
Have you ever noticed that you can be going along, minding your own
business, when all of a sudden... WHAM! Someone gives you a piece of
information that makes you ask a bunch of questions? Hey, let's face it:
Asking intelligent questions is one of the things that Atari users do
best. We bought Atari computers, didn't we? John Michael Zorko posts:
"I have a 4M 1040ST, stock 68000 inside. I use it solely for MIDI as
a sequencer/editor/librarian.
My question is: What is this MultiTOS? One can infer from the name
that it is a multitasking extension to TOS, is this correct? If this
is true, I have the following questions:
1. Will it work on 68000s or should I get a bigger Atari?
2. How much disk space does it consume?
3. Are there any cut-and-paste capabilities, a la Windows/OS2,
between applications? This question is important if i'm going to
think of running CuBase (Steinberg) and X-OR (Dr. T's) together
and have them cooperate.
4. How is device contention handled (a la MIDI ports)? Queued
access?
5. Are applications protected from each other if one should crash?
I realize that this may need an 030 or 020 with the MMU chip.
6. Is it relatively compatible with the more popular MIDI
applications? (i.e. Cubase, Omega, RealTime)
I would not use it as a multitasker so much as an application
switcher. I understand the timing aspects of MIDI and realize that
stolen CPU cycles could result in degraded MIDI performance, and my
music is very, very important to me. Another reason I ask these
questions is that I also have a 33MHz 386-based IBM PS/2 at home, and
have toyed with the idea of using it for MIDI work. The only thing is
that i'm happy with my ST, just wish it could do some of the cooler
things Windows and OS2 can do."
Jim Ness, creator of QuickCis, and all around fountain of info, tells
John:
"MultiTOS will work on standard STs, but it's very very slow. To make
it work well, you would really want to invest in something with a
68030 chip. The system will be considerably faster, and will utilize
the memory protection inherent in 68030s.
All the ports on any ST are buffered, so device contention should not
be a problem. Incoming data is stored via interrupt routines, until
the application is ready to receive.
You are correct in being concerned about timing. With a fast cpu and
minimal multitasking (as in, don't run 10 programs at a time), you
should be able to keep up with MIDI at full speed, and not have timing
problems. But, I emphasize FAST CPU.
There are also ways to adjust which program gets the most cpu cycles,
just like Windows.
The Atari products have had a clipboard spec in place for a few months
now, which allow appropriately written programs to do cut/paste
operations. So, it's all up to the programmer of the applications you
are using, to use the new spec. This spec will see a lot of use in
MultiTOS programs."
John mulls over Jim's answer:
"OK, so getting a bigger, better pooter is a given. I can live with
that. Now, the question is -- which bigger, better pooter? Falcon or
TT? BTW -- how much are TTs going for these days, and how compatible
are they with ST MIDI applications?"
Jim adds more to think about:
"Well, for MultiTOS to work, I'd suggest the TT (basic 2meg with no HD
goes for about $1300).
But, for MIDI, I'd suggest the Falcon. Slower than the ST, but the
MIDI folks are specifically upgrading for the Falcon; something they
definitely did not do for the TT.
You might want to consider an accelerator upgrade for your ST,
instead."
As is normal, Albert Dayes of Atari Explorer Magazine has more info:
"Multi-TOS is Atari's Multi-Tasking operating system for running
multiple GEM applications at the same time. Even though it can run on
a 68000 based machine I think it is somewhat risky. Since the memory
protection is only software and not hardware the protection of each
memory block that each program runs in is not as secure. This can
cause all sorts of problems. I would think that any 68030 cpu based
Atari would work much faster and safer since it has hardware memory
protection."
I don't want anyone to think that I'm belittling Albert for having scads
of information ready on almost any subject. Albert is one of the busiest,
most well-informed individuals around and always has something useful to
say. Thanks Albert!
On the subject of chip versions (68000, 68030, and like that), Tim Rule
posts:
"I have spoken to a Motorola employee who had some involvement in the
680x0 processors. His version of the story is that there was, until
about 5 months ago, an 050 project which basically brought the 68K up
in line with intels 486 in performance and vastly improved the support
for virtual memory and multi-tasking. It was to have the facility of
connecting several 050s in parallel with each other. The integration
concept was carried forward to include a new series of MMU chips and
slave processors for the 68K (I think he meant the likes of DSPs and
video processors). Anyway, the 060 project was also going on in the
background which took the concepts of the 050 and, utilizing CRISK
technology, made the whole lot much faster. What happened was that it
was decided the 050 would not be fast enough to compete with the intel
P5 (586 at the time) and so the 050 was just scrapped so that the 060
would come through sooner. I assume that this lady knew what she was
talking about."
Howard Jones posts a good, old fashioned, want-ad:
"Help for the visually impaired wanted. I am teacher of computing
studies in a high school in Wollongong, Australia. We are using Atari
STs."
Albert Dayes (see? what'd I tell ya?), tells Howard:
"You might want to download MegaWriter it has a mode that has very
large letters approximately 3/4 of an inch high. One of the authors
is an eye doctor too so he (Dr. Bruce Noonan) can probably provide
with some good information on what is a good magnifier for the ST."
From The Atari ST Arts Forum
============================
Jim Linton asks for help with his STe:
"A few months ago I purchased a Atari STE and I am having a few
problems. I have several game programs that just won't work. I believe
that the STE has TOS 1.6 or 1.62 and the standard ST had TOS 1.2. Is
there a "patch" or other fix for this problem? I love the ST but there
are several hundred dollars involved here and I like to try to fix
this. Can you be of any help?"
Mike Mortilla of ZNET Online tells Jim:
"You might check the Ataripro lib (maybe this one too?) for the
keywords: fix, patch and TOS. There was a file recently which listed
*ALL* the necessary patches to date based on TOS version and machine,
etc. Included with the file are all the necessary patches! I know the
STe had (has) some problems with certain programs (games and MIDI if I
recall correctly), and I'm not sure all of them have been resolved.
If you're having problems with commercial software, check out the
Atari Vendors Forum, too. There are some MIDI vendors who have areas
in the MIDI forums, but they also lurk around here too. How many meg
is your STe? If it's got more than 1 meg, there is a prg to trick it
into thinking it's only got 1 meg. This will allow some programs to
run which might otherwise bomb.
I don't have an STe, so i can't help too much more, but maybe some
kind soul will jump in. If you name the specific
prg/game/application that's giving you a problem, you stand a better
chance of getting the answer that will help you."
From The Atari Vendors Forum
============================
Y'know how good you feel when you find a really great deal on something
that everyone else around you is paying top dollar for? David Hagood lets
us in on his little piece of good luck:
"I found a place selling SCSI CD-ROM's for $195 plus shipping. These
are True Big Blue drives and built like a brick. Unfortunately, I
cannot seem to get it to work on my system. If somebody out there will
help me, I will pass on where I got the drives (nothing like a little
blackmail...) The drive ID's itself as "TOSHIBA CD-ROM DRIVE:XM"
using IDCHECK.PRG. I have it connected to my TT as unit 14 (SCSI bus
ID #6). I have an Insite Floptical at the end of the chain and have no
problems talking to it. I am using ICD PRO level software at version
6.0.x. When my system boots I get my Quantum and Insite logged in just
fine, but not the CD-ROM (no message at all from it). I have tried
making the CD-ROM unit 10, no dice. I have kicked my max sector size
up to 8K, no dice. I have installed MetaDOS, no dice on both the ICD
CD-ROM driver or the Atari driver (device does not respond). I'd
rather have a MiNT FSX for the CD-ROM than use MetaDOS. Any ideas?"
Albert Dayes asks David:
"Does metados (or the version you have) only work with CD-ROM devices
on the ASCI side after a host adapter like ICD? Is it supposed to
work with the SCSI bus on the TT? Also what type of Toshiba is it?
Is it a 3301 or and older 3201 or 3101?"
David tells Albert:
"Its a Toshiba 3232 drive, and MetaDOS does work (sort of) on the SCSI
bus. I can now pull a directory of the disk, but any attempt to access
a file larger than 10K kills the drive. I think there is a bug in the
MetaDOS driver. The guy at ICD told me that there was a MiNT FSX for
CD-ROM but I don't know were to get it. Does Atari have a BBS anymore?
Perhaps the CODEHEAD bbs, but I don't know the number."
Albert keeps the ideas coming:
"I would think your best bet would have been ICD or Atari. How many
directories deep can you go on the CD-ROM drive? Is it only when you
access files does it have problems or does it also have when you move
around the disc."
David replies:
"It doesn't matter how deep I am: root or six deep. I have an extra
thousand folders added so I don't think its the 40 folder problem. I
think its just the Metados driver going south...
I got MetaDOS to (kind of) work: I can pull a directory of the ROM now
but accessing a file larger than about 10K kills the drive. I did pull
the term packs on the drives, and the connectors are all Centronics 50
pin connectors, not 50 pin headers, so it is impossible to plug them
in wrong. (plus, I am an electronics engineer and I know how to plug
headers in, and to check that I did it right if something doesn't
work)."
Stephen Hebditch posts:
"My old Seagate ST238R disk drive recently died and I've just replaced
it with a Mitsubishi SP-MR535 drive I got a good deal on. I was told
by the company that sold it that this had 5 heads and 971 cylinders -
there wasn't any documentation with the drive unfortunately. However,
when formatting it with the version 6.0.6 of the host software I got a
sense error $90 during the formatting stage.
Dropping this down to a lower number of cylinders I was able to get
past the format stage, however it then came up with a load of sector
errors while partitioning... So I reduced the number of cylinders to
870, formatted okay, had only a couple of extra bad sectors while
partitioning, but then got a "Drive timeout while trying to reassign
bad sector: sense code $FF". Have I been given the wrong number of
cylinders for this drive? Is it faulty? Could it have been damaged
while trying to format it with the wrong number of cylinders?"
Geez, maybe I should change the name of this column to "Albert Says".
Albert tells Stephen:
"You might try the most current version of the ICD software which is
6.07 and its in the library. Also for the specs on your drive try the
IBM hardware forum (GO IBMHW). Several people seem to have their
books on hard drives open and can usually give your heads, cylinders,
etc information without too much of a problem."
Stephen checks around and tells Albert:
"Thanks for that tip about the IBMHW forum - I found a useful file
there listing the specifications of just about every drive that ever
existed. It confirms the details my supplier gave me. It's looking
like the new drive is faulty. :-("
Last week, Charles F. Johnson, while explaining why CodeHead Technology's
WARP9 Screen accelerator would not speed up a FALCON030 much, he said
"MTOS is sluggish because of its internal code." This week, Alex Kiernan
tells Charles:
"Sadly I'll second that, MTOS has some real goofy code in the AES :-(
Roll on MTOS 2.0."
Charles replies:
"Goofy" is the word, all right."
From The Atari Portfolio Forum
==============================
Aren't PORTFOLIOs the best fun ever? (insert Dudly Moore cackle here).
The thing that I've always found annoying about them is that they are not
indestructible. Evidently, Thomas Wallentin has found that out also. He
posts:
"Where can I find parts for Portfolio? I need the flat cable that goes
from the keyboard to the screen,and the LCD display."
William Osburn tells Thomas:
"You need more than the flat cable. The keyboard is a membrane-type
keyboard with an integral cable built into it. Actually, it's a
flexible printed circuit board. Obviously, you've had trouble with
the material rubbing off the end of the connector from opening/closing
the PORT many times. You will need to find someone with a dead PORT
and replace it like I did or send it back to Atari for $110 and get a
new one. Is the Sharp PC 3000 constructed similarly?
Does anyone know?"
Aidan Heritage asks:
"Has anyone had experience in getting a port repaired? Mine has gone
down on me this week - makes funny beeping noises if you move the
screen, and won't switch on - unless you tilt the screen to almost
shut, press the cold boot switch and fiddle with it. But even then,
as soon as you press the OFF switch, it STAYS off! I popped down to
the local electrical shop and picked up a new one for just under one
hundred pounds sterling - which I suspect is going to work out cheaper
than getting the old one repaired!"
Peter Bennett tells Aidan:
"I get the impression that you are in the UK which is where we are
based. We've been trying to find someone who will repair Ports and
have just managed to locate somebody. If you are interested, leave me
an email message and I'll give you his number."
Aidan replies:
"yes, I am in the UK - and would love to have the number! That way, I
can have one port in the office and one at home - or one on and one in
the wash!"
Peter chuckles:
"Ok will do...hmmm - one in the wash!? ;-0"
David Stewart asks:
"Has anyone out there used the Becker and Partners 256K RAM cards or
the 512K RAM cards? I have heard negative reports about the 1 meg and
beyond cards that they produce, but so far nothing about the smaller
cards. I have an application that might do well with a 256K RAM card,
but I need to be sure these are stable ... and also, do they require a
device driver to run? (I.E. do they take up any of the Port's internal
memory?) I'm mostly interested in the regular-sized card, not the
so-called "memory module" devices."
BJ Gleason, 'foliomeister, and all around good guy, tells David:
"I used one of the 256k memory cards in germany during a trip there.
As far as I am aware, there was no driver, but the cards were very
stable..."
David replies the way any self-respecting Portfolio junkie would:
"Please tell me more ... in fact, tell me every detail about the cards
that you can. I called Germany for details, but it is a bit difficult
to get too technical since I don't speak a word of German (B&P was
nice enough to find someone to speak English to me, but I didn't want
to tax their patience too much).
You just put the card in the Port and started working with it? No
extra software or special gimmicks? Was the entire card drive A: or
was it split into two drives of 128K each? Did it "look and feel"
exactly like a regular RAM card?
Sorry, you probably don't know much more than you already told me, but
I'm very interested in these cards. I hope that I can import some to
offer over here, but the prices are steeper than the Optrol cards.
RAM has some advantages over FlashRAM, though, and FlashRAM has some
advantages over RAM ... I'd like to be able to use both! <g>"
Well folks, that about wraps up this week's goodies. C'mon back next
week, take your shoes off, kick back, relax, and listen to what they are
saying when...
PEOPLE ARE TALKING
***********************************************************************
IMPORTANT NOTICE!
=================
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PARDON OUR DUST
===============
We are currently rearranging the databases, so, until we're done you
may not find some files where you expect them to be. Specifically, the
Sound & Graphics database has been changed to Sound & Music, the Art
database has been changed to Art & Graphics, and the Educational database
has been changed to Atari Online. The latter change is to accomodate files
uploaded from Atari Corp. Thanks for your patience.
If you downloaded the Falcon program, BOOTCONF.ZIP, be advised that it
has trashed at least one Falcon's non-volatile RAM. Use EXTREME caution,
if you choose to use this program.
DELPHI- It's getting better all the time!
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> KC SHOW NEWS STR SHOW NEWS A Date Change..
""""""""""""""""""""""""""
KANSAS CITY ATARI CONNECTION IS PROUD TO ANNOUNCE AGAIN...
KANSAS CITY ATARIFEST '93
As we had a conflict of dates with two other long running shows, we
have moved our show date to remove this conflict. The new show date is
listed below, we are sorry for any inconvenience this has caused. The
location is the same. The location for the show is Stadium Inn, 7901 E 40
Hwy., The date of the show will be June 26th and 27th. Ticket prices at
the door will be 5.00 dollars each day. Advance tickets will be 4.00
dollars each, for advance tickets, please send 4.00 dollars per ticket to:
Kansas City AtariFest, P.O. Box 1653, Lee Summit, MO 64063 or if you
belong to a user group please mail a request for a user group information
pack.
To make room reservations please call 1-800-325-7901, we are also
working with a local travel agent to get special airfares for the show.
You may call 1-800-874-7691 to take advantage of the special fares.
For more information please leave Email as follows; GEnie, B.welsch,
B.Frazier2, J.krzysztow, for CompuServe, Leave for Jeff Krzysztow at
74027,707, for Delphi, Bobtrow or you can call (816)224-9021, or mail to
the address listed above.
We hope you will join us to welcome the following companies; Cali-Co
software, ICD, MissionWare Software, Fair-Dinkum Software, Systems For
Tomorrow, New Dimensions Computer Center, Electronic Spinster Graphics,
Compu-Seller West, ChroMagic Software, Paul's Software, The Codeheads,
Clear Thinking Software, S.K.Ware, and a lot more!! Watch for updates to
this list or check our Genie topic (cat 11 topic 11)
Bruce Welsch
KCAC Special Events Coordinator
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:HOW TO GET YOUR OWN GENIE ACCOUNT:
_________________________________
Set your communications software to Half Duplex (or Local Echo)
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Upon connection type HHH (RETURN after that).
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Type: XTX99587,CPUREPT then, hit RETURN.
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13. After-NAMM come the demos and the data in . . . . . . . ......MIDI
14. Toshiba cuts prices, ships T4500: FREE exhibit tickets on.....LAPTOPS
15. NeXT Computer to become a software company only...............UNIX
Welcome to...
|"""| |"""| |"""""""""""""""""""""""|
| | | ||"""""| | Your |
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|===||=====||===||=====| |=======================|
Your RT Hosts: John Peters [GENIELAMP]
Jim Flanagan [JFLANAGAN] & Mike White [M.WHITE25]
THE FEBRUARY ISSUES OF GEnieLamp ARE NOW ONLINE!
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
NEW FILES IN THE LIBRARY!
"""""""""""""""""""""""""
1109 SEE.EXE "SEE" File Utilities
1108 GARLIC-MAGIC.ZIP "Garlic Magic" - by George Knoblauch
1107 EFORUM11.ZIP Electronic Publishers Forum - #11
1106 ANSIMOUS ANSI Editor for Macs (SEA)
1105 V6I6.ASC The Teleputing Hotline (Vol. 6, #6)
1104 REXXCOM-DPA.ZIP REXXCOM - ASCII Publishing System
1100 CANE0293.ZIP CANE calendars of events in N.E.
1099 DPANEW12.ZIP REXXCOM version of "News" for 2/93
1097 EP-WIN.EXE DEMO W/Grapics E.Pulishing Windows
1096 ORPH141C.ZIP Orpheus v.1.41 - Disk 3 of 3
1095 ORPH141B.ZIP Orpheus v.1.41 - Disk 2 of 3
1094 ORPH141A.ZIP Orpheus v.1.41 - From Hyperion
PACIFIC EDGE ON GEnie! The Pacific Edge Magazine has joined the
"""""""""""""""""""""" GEnieLamp RoundTable. Watch for new issues
in the library and reader support in the bulletin board. The premier
issue will be the new File Of The Week this Friday night. Can't
wait? Download EDGE0193.ZIP, File #1062.
### ###################
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GEnie ICD RoundTable Page 1220
GEnie Information copyright (C) 1991 by General Electric
Information Services/GEnie, reprinted by permission
***********************************************************************
> GEMULATOR 2.1!! STR InfoFile THE NEWEST RELEASE VERSION INFO
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
GEMULATOR VERSION 2.1
=====================
NEW FEATURES AND IMPROVEMENTS
SMALLER HARDWARE REQUIREMENTS
INTERNATIONAL AVAILABILITY
SEE IT AT THE SAC SHOW
LOWER U.S. PRICES
Branch Always Software has just released version 2.1 of the Gemulator,
the Atari ST emulator for DOS and Windows compatible PCs. Gemulator allows
a 386 or 486 based PC to directly run most Atari ST software (except for
games and music software) and supports all versions of TOS, four different
screen resolutions, and can provide up to 8 megabytes of RAM to ST
programs.
Gemulator 2.1 is now available from computer dealers in Europe and North
America. In the U.S. and Canada, the list price is now only $229 U.S.
which includes the Gemulator board, emulation software, and U.S. TOS 2.06
ROMs.
Gemulator 2.1 is now also available in the U.K., France, Holland, and
Germany. The versions sold in each of those countries contain TOS 2.06
ROMs appropriate for each country, and all documentation and software has
been fully translated.
Gemulator 2.1 will be shown at the upcoming Sacramento Atari Expo on March
13th and 14th in Sacramento, California. Come by the Branch Always
Software booth and see Gemulator for yourself!
Version 2.1 has the following new features and improvements:
- the separate 386 and 486 versions of Gemulator have been combined into
one single convenient version which is just as fast (or even slightly
faster on some machines) than Gemulator 2.0.
- the ability to create a virtual Atari hard disk partition on any size
DOS partition means that you can now safely read and write Atari files
anywhere on your PC's hard disk and even over the network, without
having to reformat or repartition the hard disk as before.
- a 4 megabyte PC can now emulate a full megabyte of ST RAM (up from 512K
before). Gemulator can emulate up to 8 megabytes of ST RAM, double the
4 megabyte limit of the real Atari ST.
- Pagestream and some other programs now print up to 10 times faster. The
actual speedup will depend on the size and contents of the Pagestream
document. A full page 8.5" x 11" 300 dpi Pagestream document prints out
in about 3 minutes on an HP LaserJet printer.
- the real-time clock in the ST keyboard is now emulated. This allows
TOS 2.06 to boot up with the current DOS time and date.
- the "missing keystrokes" bug from Gemulator 2.0 and other bugs are
fixed.
Gemulator already has several features not found in the real Atari ST, and
in many ways it is much better than a real ST:
- the ability to emulate up to 8 megabytes of ST RAM (described above)
makes it ideal when using a lot of GDOS fonts, running the new
MultiTOS or, editing very large Calamus and Pagestream documents.
- the ability to emulate TT medium resolution (640x480 16 colors) allows
most GEM based Atari ST programs to run with more colors and with
better graphics than is possible on the real ST.
- switching from color to monochrome (or vice versa) is as simple as
pressing one key. Forget having to use two monitors and swapping cables
all the time!
- each Gemulator board can hold up to 4 sets of TOS ROMs and you can
easily switch from one version of TOS to another by just pressing a
few keys. This allows you to use the supplied TOS 2.06 with most of
your ST software, but switch back to TOS 1.0 or TOS 1.4 for running
earlier software not compatible with TOS 2.06.
- due to the ever increasing speed of PCs and the availability of the
486 DX2 clock doubler chip, you can easily upgrade your 33 Mhz 486 PC
to a 66 Mhz PC and run Atari ST software up to 3 times faster than a
real ST. That's faster than a Mega STE, faster than a 20 Mhz
accelerator, and In many cases, as fast as the Falcon.
Gemulator now has smaller hardware requirements. Your PC need only have
the following:
- a 386 or 486 CPU
- 4 megabytes of RAM
- a 720K 3.5" floppy disk drive
- a VGA card and monitor
- 1.7 megabytes of hard disk space
- a mouse is optional but recommended
Gemulator consists of a PC board which plugs into any 8-bit or 16-bit
AT-style slot. The board is used to install TOS ROMs which are needed to
run Atari ST software on a PC. The emulator itself is simply copied to the
hard disk and run from the DOS prompt or a DOS window just like any other
PC program.
The speed of Gemulator's emulation is affected by the speed of your PC's
processor, hard disk, video card, and other factors, but it is usually
proportional to the speed of the processor (the 386 or 486 chip). Below
is a table of various processors and the APPROXIMATE speed of emulation
compared to a standard ST (which of course has a relative speed of 1.0):
386/16 - 0.3
386/33 - 0.6
386/40 - 0.8
486/25 - 0.9
486/33 - 1.2
486/50 - 1.8
486/66 - 2.4
386 based computers running slower than 33 Mhz are not recommended for use
with Gemulator due to the relatively slow speed of emulation. Gemulator
emulates the 68000 chip entirely in software and so a fast 386 is
required.
The Gemulator package comes with a set of TOS 2.06 ROMs, but if you wish
to use your own ROMs, the board and emulator can now be purchased without
any TOS ROMs for $179, a $50 savings. You must of course supply your own
TOS 1.0, 1.2, 1.4, 1.6 or 2.06 ROMs before being able to use Gemulator.
In the U.S. and Canada, Gemulator is distributed by:
PMC (Purple Mountain Computers)
15600 N.E. 8th Street, Unit #A3-412
Bellevue, WA 98008, U.S.A.
For ordering information, call 1-206-399-8700.
In Europe (including the U.K. and Germany), Gemulator is distributed by:
ACN / Atari ST Nieuws
Postbus 5011
2000 CA Haarlem
The Netherlands
For ordering information;
phone 011-31-23-351100
fax 011-31-23-351444.
To upgrade from Gemulator 1.0 to Gemulator 2.1, send $49.95 is U.S. funds
and your Gemulator registration card directly to us:
Branch Always Software
14150 N.E. 20th Street, Suite 302
Bellevue, WA 98007, U.S.A.
Users who last year upgraded to Gemulator 2.0 have already been sent a
free Gemulator 2.1 upgrade disk. If you upgraded to 2.0 but haven't
received the 2.1 disk, please contact us and make sure that we have your
latest mailing address in our records.
Here is a sample of what Gemulator users are saying about Gemulator 2.1:
Darek,
I've been using Gemul8r 2.1 on a GW 2K 486-66 Local bus video and IDE
controller. I have the virtual HD on a Stacked partition, resulting in a
55+ meg capacity (I think). I am primarily using ST mode to access some
of my terrific ST software, including Avant Vector, Migraph OCR,
Pagestream, MegaPaint, MugShot, MVG, and many associated DA's, utilities,
and applications.
2.1 is a *terrific* improvement over earlier versions. I think the
virtual HD is a good functional solution to HD access, and runs
flawlessly (as does everything else I've tried. This has got to qualify
as "Hack of the Year"!
...
At this point, I think Gemul8r is a SOLID, FUNCTIONAL system. It's easy
to use, very SW compatible, and gives me continued access to my best ST
software. Nice job Darek! Thanks for a great product at a fair price...
- Marty Klein, Gemulator 2.1 user
______________________________________________________________________
> NVN WANTS YOU! STR InfoFile Another Network Supports Atari!
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""
National Videotext Network (NVN) has recently added an Atari ST Forum
to it's growing lists of available services. The Atari ST Forum is ready
and waiting for you!
The future of NVN will be one which continues to remain sensitive and
responsive to market needs. Additional services and advances in electronic
information will continue to be added, to provide unique and interesting
services on an on-going basis.
NVN service offerings can be broken into three categories: Basic,
Premium, and Premium Plus.
****************************************
****************************************
** 9600 BAUD acious! **
** For users with 9600 baud modems **
** SAME PRICE AS 2400 BAUD! **
** TRUE on line savings! **
****************************************
****************************************
Basic Services
--------------
Most of the Basic services are available 24 hours a day with no
connect time charges beyond the basic membership fee. However, a select
group have functions for which transaction fees are charged. Basic
services are accessible through a flat rate charge of $5.95 per month.
Premium Services
----------------
For Premium services, Members pay connect charges for the amount of
time spent in a particular service. Premium services are accessible
Monday through Friday for a connect time charge of $9.00/hour from 8 am to
6 pm, and $6.00/hour from 6 pm to 8 am; and on Saturday and Sunday for a
connect time charge of $6.00 all day (6 pm Friday til 8 am Monday),
central time zone. 9600 Baud access is available at no additional cost!
Think of the advantages of downloading at 9600 baud for 9.00 hr Prime Time
or 6.00 hr non-prime time!
Order an extended NVN Membership of 6 or 12 months, pay for it in
advance and receive a bonus in connect time at no additional charge.
Choose from two subscription plans:
6-Month Membership
Pay just $30 for a 6-month Membership and receive a usage credit that
entitles you to $15 of connect-time in the Premium services of your
choice. Your total savings using this plan would be over $20!*
12 Month Membership
Pay $50 for a full year's Membership and get even more free time
on-line. We'll give you a $25 usage credit to use in your favorite Premium
services or try out new ones. You could save as much as $45.*
For more information about either of these plans, give us a call at
1-800-336- 9096.
*Both extended Membership options, including free usage credits are
nonrefund-able/nontransferable. Members are responsible for all Premium
charges over the $15 or $25 usage credit.
You can join NVN one of two ways. By voice phone 1-800-336-9096
(Client Services) or via modem phone 1-800-336-9092. You will be issued
an Account # (usually within 24 hours) National Videotex Network and the
Atari ST Forum will be waiting for you.
_____________________________________________________________
> STR Mail Call "...a place for the readers to be heard"
"""""""""""""
STReport's MailBag
""""""""""""""""""
Messages * NOT EDITED * for content
-----------------------------------
From GEnie's GEnielamp RT
Topic 1 Fri Feb 12, 1993
GENIELAMP [John Peters] at 12:40 EST
Sub: STReport International Online Magazine
STReport International Online Magazine
9 message(s) total.
************
------------
Category 12, Topic 1
Message 1 Fri Feb 12, 1993
ST.REPORT at 23:34 EST
02/12/93 STR 907 "The Original * Independent * Online Magazine!"
""""""""""""""""
- The Editor's Desk - CPU Report - PORTFOLIO NEWS
- K & R C DEV system - DELL CUTS $$$ - COMPAQ TO EXCEL IBM!
- APPLE-8 NEW Products - PRODIGY SUIT - PEOPLE TALKING!
- SST ATARI SHOW NEWS - KC SHOW UPDATES - STR Confidential
-* NeXT DROPS HARDWARE VENTURES! *-
-* FALCON DUE MARCH 1st *-
-* FALCON SPECS *-
Ralph @ STReport International Online Magazine
FILE # 1098
------------
Category 12, Topic 1
Message 3 Mon Feb 15, 1993
D.D.MARTIN [Swampy] at 19:42 EST
Hi All!
Gee, It's nice and "friendly" over here. <g>
I want to say thank you to John Peters and GEnie management for providing
GEnie Atari users a place to obtain STReport as well as a discussion area
here in the GEnieLamp area.
Rest assured that there are many folks who _do_ want to read STR and
didn't want to have to go to other services to obtain it. I'm sure that
much of the "politics" will now be removed from the discussion area and we
can proceede to proceede. %^)
Thanks again John and GEnie! Ya done GOOD!
Hugs...Swampy
------------
Category 12, Topic 1
Message 4 Mon Feb 15, 1993
D.JACOBSON2 at 20:21 EST
D.D. - I second that "much obliged"!!
Ralph and/or Joe,
It may be a good idea that one of you send out a general mailing to all of
those users who sent us requests to GE-mail the past issue or two that we
are now located here and that they can once again download STReport. Some
of them may not have seen the last issue or two and may be still
expecting to find it in their mailbox.
Dana @ STReport International Online Magazine
------------
Category 12, Topic 1
Message 5 Mon Feb 15, 1993
C.KLIMUSHYN [-Chuck-] at 22:26 EST
Dear Ralph, Joe, and Co.
Thanks so much for the E-mailed issues while the storm was a going on.
Rest assured John Peterson will get a thank you letter also. Do you have
an exact E-mail address for him?
Best All, -Chuck-
------------
Category 12, Topic 1
Message 6 Tue Feb 16, 1993
GENIELAMP [John Peters] at 02:08 EST
D.D., (all),
My product manager has asked me to hide the file and to put
everything on hold until the behind the scenes stuff can addressed.
Until I hear something from GEnie, I am (thank goodness) "out of the
loop" on this issue.
In interest of my own personal sanity, :) I will not respond here on
anything that concerns STReport until then.
John Peters
GEnieLamp Online Magazine
Member, Disktop Publishing Assoc.
------------
Category 12, Topic 1
Message 7 Tue Feb 16, 1993
D.D.MARTIN [Swampy] at 20:11 EST
JOHN --
I understand, and didn't mean to put you "in the middle", but just wanted
to express my thanks to the "powers that be" for offering readers of
STReport a home.
It's comfortable over here. %^)
Hugs...Swampy
------------
Category 12, Topic 1
Message 8 Wed Feb 17, 1993
NEVIN-S at 23:09 EST
John, I do hope that you will be allowed to carry ST Report. I have always
enjoyed it, and hope to see it have a home here.
--Nevin
------------
Category 12, Topic 1
Message 9 Thu Feb 18, 1993
D.D.MARTIN [Swampy] at 18:56 EST
NEVMAN!
Gee... I like the friendly faces over here! <g>
Hugs...Swampy
------------
Topic 5 Sun Feb 14, 1993
ST.REPORT at 08:32 EST
Sub: LETTERS TO THE EDITOR
STReport Online Magazine LETTERS
"""""""""""""""""""""""" TO
THE EDITOR
4 message(s) total.
************
------------
Category 12, Topic 5
Message 1 Sat Feb 13, 1993
S.CORLEY1 [SCOTTJ] (Forwarded)
Ralph, nice to see you and STR back on GEnie. I do have one complaint
though. The quality of STR has really gone downhill since Lloyd left.
Where's the product reviews, the guest commentary and editorials, etc?
Its seems nowadays most of STR consists of filler, with Ralph grabbing any
online text file he can get his hands and putting it into STR. Its better
to put out a good but small online magazine than to take a few good
articles and pad them out with filler to make the magazine larger.
You seem to have lost a lot of your editorial skills while Lloyd was
senior editor, Ralph. The difference between the Lloyd and post-Lloyd STR
is huge, as is the difference between the STR of 5 years ago (pre-Lloyd)
and the STR of today. Oh well, at least even if the quality of STR keeps
going downhill it will be a long time before it reaches the utter depths
to which Z**** has sunk to.
------------
Category 12, Topic 5
Message 2 Sun Feb 14, 1993
ST.REPORT at 08:38 EST
Scott,
Its nice to be back.. I am constantly trying to improve STReport
so rest assured your comments are well received and appreciated. I
must admit ... that will all the distractions of late certain features
of STReport have been obvious by their absence. Steps are being
taken to enhance our humble offering. Thanks for voicing your
opinions and reading STReport.
Ralph @ STReport International Online Magazine
------------
Category 12, Topic 5
Message 3 Sun Feb 14, 1993
J.NESS [Jim] at 11:31 EST
I'm glad to see that STR has found a new home on GEnie. Maybe in a few
months you'll be able to lure Lloyd back.
-JN
------------
Category 12, Topic 5
Message 4 Sun Feb 14, 1993
D.JACOBSON2 at 12:54 EST
Scott,
With all of the recent distractions online and personally, things have
been hectic. Personally, I haven't dome much for the magazine due to the
renewal of changes at work that has kept me busy. As Ralph has
mentioned, look for things to get back to normal once everyone is
settled. I have a few things in the works, and a few ideas forming for
other articles. You, and the rest of our readers, won't be disappointed.
Jim,
I dunno, I bet that Lloyd is enjoying his "retirement" and may want to
keep it that way!! <<grin>> Still, I know what you mean.
Dana @ STReport International Online Magazine
------------
FROM DELPHI'S ATARI AREAS
SAY WHAT?
=========
48652 15-FEB 13:27 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48151)
From: EIDSVOOG To: ABARBIERO
I don't dispute anything you're saying. I'm just trying to point out what
Charles said. Actually, it came to you here second-hand through Norm and
he may not have phrased it the same way Charles said it a couple of years
ago. Both Charles and I are heavily into studio work here in L.A.
Yes, there are some "RABID Atari musicians" out there. I don't contest
that. It's just that the majority of the professionals that Charles and I
associate with in the music business seem to choose the Mac these days.
This does not mean that the Atari is not a great machine for professional
music applications. It does not mean that there aren't any professional
studio players using Atari's (there are plenty of them). It is not
intended to put Atari fanatics on the defensive. It's simply an
observation -- an observation that I personally wish was not true.
It's one thing to be completely devoted to a machine. I know that's true
of me and Charles -- we're blindly devoted to the Atari. Otherwise, we
wouldn't continue trying to hold a losing business together in hopes that
Atari might start selling enough computers for us to start making a
profit.
But it's another thing to let that blind devotion inhibit one from seeing
the truth and reality. That's one of the problems with the management at
Atari. They don't seem to realize how the rest of the computer world has
been progressing while they've been marching in place.
Atari is very lucky that the major MIDI developers continue to support the
Atari versions of their software, even though they are more heavily
concentrating on the other, more profitable platforms. I'm actually
surprised they continue, with the way the Atari market continues to
dwindle.
John
48653 15-FEB 13:43 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48162)
From: EIDSVOOG To: ABARBIERO
Andreas,
Now that message is exactly what I'm talking about when I mention
"blindness". You're implying that because a few very respected and famous
musicians use Atari computers and have purchased them by choice, that it
means Atari is "king in music".
So you also think that, because Apple "GIVES its stuff to the big names"
that it means fewer musicians _choose_ to buy Mac computers. Do you
realize how flawed this logic is?
I'm not saying that Macs are better for music than Atari computers. I'm
saying that they are more popular among musicians and that more Macs are
sold and used for music than Ataris. Why do you refuse to believe this or
admit it? Do you have sales figures to dispute this?
I'm also not saying that Apple or IBM are committed to the music niche,
either. They probably didn't see a need to appear at the NAMM show. They
didn't need to because their presence was made very clear by the support
of the music developers. There were far more Macs visible in NAMM booths
than Ataris. And there were far more "clones" visible than Ataris.
I'd prefer not to have to point these things out, myself. But your
illogic has forced me into the situation. I personally think that Atari
computers are "best" for MIDI applications. And I'd love to say that
Atari is "King of Music", but unfortunately that's not true. I'm sorry
you forced me to reveal it.
John
48654 15-FEB 14:12 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48277)
From: EIDSVOOG To: ABARBIERO
The Hotz box releases "raw creativity of the musician"?!?
Sheesh, that couldn't be further from the truth. What it does is
_restrict_ his creativity. It imposes a "template" upon the musician,
strictly defining which notes he may or may not play. It's the musical
equivalent of paint-by-numbers, a concept that probably holds as much
water among true artists as the Hotz box does among true musicians.
Dream on.
John
48655 15-FEB 14:57 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48345)
From: EIDSVOOG To: ANALOG4
That's a very astute observation.
The difference where the Hotz box is concerned is that by the nature of
the instrument, it imposes a set of rules that are defined by _someone
else_. That is, either you spend an incredible amount of time learning how
to program and set up the Hotz box yourself (possibly more difficult than
the process of learning music -- the process which one is trying to
avoid), or you simply use the preset configurations that are included with
the Hotz box.
These preset configurations are "templates" or "overlays" which limit the
range of actual notes you are able to use. I hardly see this as an
expansion of the creative process, but rather an inhibiting. When I play,
I don't want to play notes that are defined by someone else, I want the
freedom to play any note I choose. There's no such thing as a "wrong
note" and I defy anyone to tell me I can't play a particular note.
As a professional musician, I am naturally going to have a very snobby
attitude where a device such as the Hotz box is concerned. The enticement
of the Hotz box goes to the very core of human nature -- man's desire to
get something for nothing. If people think that they can become overnight
musicians without learning anything, they'll naturally become excited by
the prospect. It's similar to the chord organ, or a spirograph, or a
paint-by-numbers set, or as Norm mentioned, a karioke machine. It's the
equivalent of "politically correct" music -- "musical fascism" -- "you
vill play only zee correct notes!"
This is not to say that the Hotz box is not a valid product. It has its
place, just as the chord organ has its place. But the perception that
some people seem to have about it is incorrect. It doesn't expand one's
creativity or generate any talent that is not already there. Instead it
restricts true talent while possibly synthesizing to some degree a false
impression of talent.
I have nothing against Jimmy Hotz personally. I've met him on several
occasions and consider him to be a friend. He is definitely a very warm
and caring human being. He's also very forgiving, too, if he's ever heard
my views in the past about the Hotz box, because it's never diminished his
congeniality. <grin>
John
48660 15-FEB 16:11 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48655)
From: ANALOG4 To: EIDSVOOG
To tell you the truth, I don't know too much about the Hotz box, never
even touched one. Your description of it is interesting, since I didn't
realize that it allowed you limit the notes to be played, presumably to
keep a person from playing something "off key." But as you pointed out,
it's not the notes you play, but how you play them. I'm not much of a
keyboard player, but I played guitar in local clubs for almost two
decades. Some of my favorite riffs are comprised of notes that, if phrased
wrong, would sound like barf. It's one of those things where, after you
learn the rules, you learn how to break them. Obviously, the Hotz box
won't teach a person that skill.
---Clay
48661 15-FEB 19:31 General Information
RE: Printer Drivers (Re: Msg 48658)
From: JGALLARDO To: EIDSVOOG
John,
I want to tell you that I got my Calligrapher Gold 3 upgrade the other
week. I finally got a chance to install and use it late last week (I'll
clarify that I got it about a week & a half ago). I must say that I'm
impressed. I like how you can select from two printers, how the new
installation program works, the new "change setup" utility, the general
bug & aesthetic fixes, and the built in G+plus. I want to thank you and
Charles for supporting the ST and for your timely service in getting the
upgrade out to me. (I did this here in the forum to give a plug for
CodeHead from a satisfied user <G> )
Jose
48736 16-FEB 17:28 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48561)
From: ABARBIERO To: ATARIO
Having two OS floating around could cause some problems, imagine all the
software that would have to be written for both systems!
Dungeon Master for XWINDOWS???
Andreas@AEO
48737 16-FEB 17:32 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48652)
From: ABARBIERO To: EIDSVOOG
Well, I guess I learned a lesson. Never start a topic talking about 3rd
hand info on who said what to whom. If Atari can ship some Qantities. If
they started providing more machines with more dealers, there should not
be any reason to have a musician use anything BUT Atari.
I think the main problem is since the whole F030 broke last year, its
kinda hard to set up new dealers and sell something that isnt shipping.
After the F030 starts shipping, then they can work on getting some more
people buyng the damn things! Not to mention selling.
(hear that norm! Old info got me in trouble! Thats the last time I listen
to the crusty old guys! :-)
Andreas@AEO
48738 16-FEB 17:38 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48653)
From: ABARBIERO To: EIDSVOOG
I did not FORCE anyone to say anything here, I am trying to make the point
that the salient features that we all love about having and using Atari
computers is still valid. Just because certain people state sweeping
remarks about how this is bad, or how that is awful does not change the
basics here.
Atari is respected in the field, those MACs and clones are used because
there hasnt been decent fielding of the Atari units in the past.
Dont take what I have said out of context :-) Atari is not the king of
all computers, they have a niche which can be exploited nicely and can
then become a bigger influence on the rest of the computer scene.
If Atari dealers were as prolific as they were, say 3 years ago, VERY few
people would have a clone for music work!
Andreas@AEO
48739 16-FEB 17:53 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48654)
From: ABARBIERO To: EIDSVOOG
The Hotz system does for music what DTP does for layout.
It removes some of the impediments from manipulating the medium.
Hotz systems are designed not to create a concierto, but to allow access
to notes and sounds in an environment where how the sounds are triggered
are not limited to a static keyboard arrangement, or linear soundpads.
Sets of sounds can be arranged in a manner to allow the user the ability
to combine and organize these sounds according to his needs or wishes.
It does not replace a piano or full keyboard, it does not replace years of
music training. It does attempt to remove the mind-numbing physical
training that most intruments require to manage keys/levers/holes etc, and
actually have a coherent noise emerge. Some musicians love it. Some HATE
it. I think that it is a step in the right direction.
DTP software can take all the hassle out of arranging text and graphics on
a page, and allow someone to set things up without having a huge stack of
paper on a desk, with glue, pens, and scissors scattered all over the
place or limiting the page to what keys can be cut and placed on a press
to then duplicate a letter, book, or encyclopedia.
DTP software will not supply the talent and graphic arts skills to produce
professional documents. That is up to the individual.
Jimmy Hotz cannot make a classical muscian out of someone who does not
have a clue how music is made, but he is trying to provide the world with
a better interface!
Andreas@AEO
48975 18-FEB 21:27 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48739)
From: EIDSVOOG To: ABARBIERO
I'm sorry, but you've got your analogies confused.
The musical equivalent of a DTP program is a software sequencer/notation
program, _not_ the Hotz box. A DTP program offers non-restrictive tools
that enhance the composition of the document. A sequencer program does
the same for the audio portion of a musical composition and a notation
program does it for the visual portion of a musical composition.
If there were an equivalent of the Hotz box for DTP (actually it relates
more to word processing and writing), it would be some sort of a hybrid
tablet. This tablet -- the interface you speak of -- would contain
overlays of words grouped by style and meaning. Only a certain subset of
words would be available at any one time, but the writer could rest
assured that all of the words were spelled correctly so he wouldn't make a
spelling mistake. Not only would he be unable to improperly spell a word,
he would not have to worry about selecting an inappropriate word either,
because the available words would be pre-determined to fit within the
context of the group containing them. The writer could either spend a lot
of time himself in grouping the words into what he considered to be usable
sets, or he could take the easy way out and just select existing templates
based on someone else's idea of how to write.
Once the writer selects his group of words, he can easily select them very
quickly with no fear of stepping outside of the bounds that confined the
subset of words. He's truly free -- NOT!!
Maybe you and others can relate to this concept when it is applied to
something you know more about -- words. If this concept sounds absurd to
you, you may be beginning to understand why the Hotz box is limiting to
musicians.
Once again, this is not to say that the Hotz box does not have a place in
creating music. It's just that you seem to misunderstand it. It's a
wonderful tool for hobbyists who want to tinker around with music without
making an effort to learn anything about it. It restricts. Why not tear
off all the black notes from a piano. That would make it easier to play.
But what makes music good? Ease of creation? Or aural beauty?
I'm not against alternative musical interfaces, but let's not delude
ourselves into believing that restricting our resources is equivalent to
releasing creativity.
John
DELPHI & ATARI!
===============
48359 11-FEB 04:07 General Information
Atari Corp & DELPHI
From: BIBLINSKI To: ALL
Well, we've been working on it for a while now, and it's finally reached
the point where we can quit hinting around about it, and make an
announcement.
DELPHI and Atari Corp. have reached an agreement that provides Atari Corp.
with 5 new accounts here on DELPHI. Atari Corp. will be using those
accounts to provide better support to the DELPHI online community. Just
how those accounts will be utilized is still being developed by Atari, but
the new Atari Corp. usernames provide a general idea of the eventual
utilization. The usernames are:
ATARICORP
ATARITECH
ATARIMUSIC
AEXPLORER
AEO_MAG
One of the first things that will be happening with one or more of those
new usernames is a formal Conference about MultiTOS and the Falcon030.
The expected Atari personnel are John Townsend and Eric Smith. There is
nothing finalized about that CO yet, but watch for announcements _real
soon now_.
<g>
The ATARIMUSIC username will probably be used by interns working with
James Grunke of Atari. With the recent NAMM showing, the music market is
hotter than ever, and having Atari music staff here should bring a little
bit of that excitement to DELPHI. So, if you're a musician, or just
interested in using your Atari for musical purposes, watch for ATARIMUSIC
to join us soon.
AEO_MAG will be used by staff writers for Atari Explorer Online. Andreas
Barbiero may utilize the account occasionally, but maybe he'll let some of
the other staff members get a taste of DELPHI, too. <G>
AEXPLORER will be used by the staff of Atari Explorer magazine as a
doorway into our little community here. Hopefully, we'll see Mike Lindsay
or Darren Meers drop by occasionally, to see what life online can be like
without all the information overload some of the other services can have.
Please make the newbies feel welcome here. They're here to provide
support, and that's something many in the community have faulted Atari for
not doing enough of. Let's take advantage of that support, instead of
wasting their time with pointless questions about things they can't
discuss yet. Patience is a virtue, or so they say. When they're ready to
talk about something, I'm sure they'll be happy to give us all the
information we want.
--Gordie
48669 15-FEB 21:04 General Information
RE: Atari Corp & DELPHI (Re: Msg 48359)
From: WAYNEDUNHAM To: BIBLINSKI
Great news Gordie. We can't wait to "see" the new accounts online.
Looks like this wheel (Delphi) must have been squeeking a bit louder to
get some "grease" from Atari. :-)
Wayne
A real tempest brewing here...
AT WHAT PRICE? -> EXCLUSIVE??
=============================
BOON OR BLUNDER?
48662 15-FEB 20:03 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48312)
From: WAYNEDUNHAM To: ABARBIERO
RE: MTOS GEnie specific.....
I see and understand your point about allowing MTOS to be GEnie only
as a way of ironing out any last minute bugs before it goes into mass
comsumption.
I'm not however saying I agree with it. The more hands you get it
into, the quicker you'll find all the bugs. The largest reason however
is as I stated....With Atarians being such a fractured group now with
vast numbers of owners having no dealer, user groups, or magazine access
within easy reach only putting it on GEnie will severely limit the
percentage of the user base that Mtos is seen by. For every 10 Atari 16
bit machines out there, I'd wager that at least 50% of them languish
either unused, or running in the exact same condition as they were over a
year ago. By "same" I mean that the owner hasn't bought anything new
either hardware or software in taht (that) period of time. It may not be
that they don't want to buy anything, it's just with our isolation from
even our "Sibling Atarians" they may not know of any new stuff, or where
to buy it if they did know about it.
We need to SCREAM Mtos, Falcon, and any other positive bit of
information from the highest and most numerous mountaintops possible.
Screaming it only from GEnie (aka Mt. Everest) will only reach those
within earshot of the Himalayas. Sad for us "Mt. McKinley" folks.
Wayne
48312 10-FEB 20:11 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48305)
From: ABARBIERO To: WAYNEDUNHAM
I would agree with you 100% except for one thing.
I am helping out with the MTOS roll-out with writing about it and all, and
I look forward to GEnie getting it for ONLY ONE REASON...
GEnie is the 'official' site of Atari support, and if there are ANY
unforseen last minute bugs in the ointment, I would rather see people who
had recourse to immediate help find the problems out first and then make
sure that there is an errorless product for everyone else to get.
Atari will be getting a bigger presence here, hey, Bob does his best, but
with the others we would like to be bringing online, some major support is
about to come on in. Think of GEnie getting it first as a last minute
mini beta test!!
Andreas@AEO
48364 11-FEB 07:14 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48312)
From: OCS To: ABARBIERO
- GEnie is the 'official' site of Atari support, and if there are ANY
- unforseen last minute bugs in the ointment, I would rather see people
- who had recourse to immediate help find the problems out first and
- then make sure that there is an errorless product for everyone else to
- get.
There will never be an errorless TOS... software engineering tells you
that it is basically impossible get get _all_ bugs out of a piece of
software with this size.
Oliver
PS: Well, the KBS operating system might be the exception to this rule <
ducking> Read today's issue of c't magazine for the second part of a
three-part series about KBS (gotta get this plug in here <grin>)
48690 16-FEB 01:59 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48662)
From: JGALLARDO To: WAYNEDUNHAM
RE: MTOS
One way might be to flood Atari's new Delphi Accounts with EMail
requesting that if they choose to distribute it by uploading it on GEnie,
to also do so here on Delphi.
Jose
48696 16-FEB 03:08 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48663)
From: BIBLINSKI To: WAYNEDUNHAM
Wayne,
To be truly useful, MultiTOS must be run on either a TT or a Falcon.
Believe me when I say it sucks on a regular 8mHz ST. Too slow to be of
much real use. So, the limited, temporary, proposed distribution on GEnie
isn't as bad as it might first seem. Why get everybody excited about
something they'll end up disgusted with? (Those with TTs will probably
not be disgusted. No, they most definitely will NOT be disgusted.) And,
if it is distributed, for a limited time, on GEnie, it will generate a
little revenue for Atari, something they need probably worse than most of
us. If they do decide to distribute it freely, and that's still an if at
this point, I have no problem with them starting with GEnie, their 'home'
service, first. I doubt that the short period it's exclusive there will
make much difference in how widely it gets distributed. (If it does get
distributed that way, of course.) And, since this whole thing is pure
supposition anyway, I have to throw in that it might very well be possible
that we can work some kind of deal with Atari to get it up here as quickly
as possible, especially now that they have some accounts to use for tech
support. <g>
--Gordie
48719 16-FEB 06:58 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48662)
From: OCS To: WAYNEDUNHAM
- I see and understand your point about allowing MTOS to be GEnie only
- as a way of ironing out any last minute bugs before it goes into mass
- comsumption.
- I'm not however saying I agree with it. The more hands you get
- it into, the quicker you'll find all the bugs.
Hundreds of betatesters (official and unofficial ones) have had MTOS for
almost a year now. If it still isn't functioning decently, it is not a
matter of bugs not being found, but of getting them out of the code. I
don't really buy this "last minute bug" argumentation...
Oliver
48722 16-FEB 14:20 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48696)
From: OCS To: BIBLINSKI
- To be truly useful, MultiTOS must be run on either a TT or a Falcon.
- Believe me when I say it sucks on a regular 8mHz ST. Too slow to be
- of much real use.
Gordie, I have used it on my 8 MHz ST, and it is _not_ useless. Of
course, the CPU doesn't provide the power to allow you to work comfortably
while having a compiler running in the background (at least not with
MultiTOS/GEM, with KBS it does work due to a smart scheduling algorithm
that gives interactive processes all the time they need). But it is a
very comfortable way to switch from one program to another without having
to leave one application and start the other one. I have used the
MultiFinder quite a few times lately, and while I never needed to really
run more than one program at a time, I found it extremely useful to be
able to switch from one program to another by just clicking on it's
window. Why do you think was MultiGEM so successful (on STs!) even though
it was much worse than MultiTOS?
Oliver (I want MTOS!!!!)
PS: If it is limited to GEnie, can someone provide me with a copy on
disk? Would that be legal?
48740 16-FEB 17:55 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48662)
From: ABARBIERO To: WAYNEDUNHAM
IF Atari decides to put MTOS out as a GEnie only thing... and nothing has
been decided... then 7 days on GEnie will not kill anyone.
I am coordinating a formal CO here with J.Townshend and E.Smith for Delphi
soon. I will let you all know what happens!
Andreas@AEO
48746 16-FEB 19:21 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48662)
From: DPJ To: WAYNEDUNHAM
Wayne,
I left a similar message as yours on GEnie. I got a bunch of crap because
of it. I was given the reason that as a business, it's to Genie's
(Darlah's) best interest as a business to have an exclusive "edge". I was
also told that the other services have done this in the past, and will
continue to do so in the future. By the past, they are of course
referring to exclusive files from both Antic on CIS and Analog here on
Delphi. I replied that back _then_ when the market/userbase was much
larger, that kind of activity may have been acceptable, but today, it just
isn't so. Plus, it's a _little_ bit different when it's software from
Atari than magazine PD software. I don't like the idea of exclusive files
anywhere, as it is not fair to those who can't get it for one reason or
another. Oh well....
Dana @ STReport International Online Magazine
48747 16-FEB 19:28 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48684)
From: DPJ To: MRBURKLEY
The limited time that the file(s) will be on GEnie will be so that the
Atari area there will have "x" amount of time to have users download it
and make some money for that Atari area. Atari has how many new accounts
here? CIS has Atari accounts also. All three services having access to
these programs will enable even more feedback and possible bug reports.
I don't think that this should be restricted (by time or officialdom) to
any service - whether it be Delphi, GEnie, or CIS.
Dana @ STReport International Online Magazine
48748 16-FEB 19:38 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48696)
From: DPJ To: BIBLINSKI
I agree that the ST and STe users aren't going to get a whole lot of use
and speed out of it, but to be able to have it to play with and see the
potential will help to sell the Falcon. Not only to current Atari owners,
but perhaps to friends of Atari users who see it and can realize what it's
capable of doing (on the right machine).
I have 2 STs. I know MTOS isn't going to help _me_ much, but I certainly
want to check it out and see what it's all about. Like most Atari users,
when I know of a new program that's heralded as a great one, I want it as
fast as I can get it!! <<grin>> Having it be exclusive to one service or
another is going to cause a lot of resentment (albeit for a short(?)
period of time). If it's money that Atari is interested (and I don't
think it is), then they should sell it to anyone who wants it for a
nominal fee.
Dana @ STReport International Online Magazine
48758 16-FEB 21:07 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48740)
From: WAYNEDUNHAM To: ABARBIERO
Andreas,
If the GEnie exclusive is only 7 days then I don't have a problem with
that. In the past most GEnie exclusives have been at least 30 days which
is
unreasonable.
I must say however that 7 days of exclusivity would pretty much shoot
down the "find the bugs" excuse. 7 days is nowhere near enough time to
find bugs, nevermind get the fixes coded and re-uploaded. Not that I'm
advocating a longer exclusivity, I'm definitely not! :-)
Wayne
48759 16-FEB 21:15 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48746)
From: WAYNEDUNHAM To: DPJ
I totally agree Dana. Services negotiating exclusive contracts with
magazines, PD authors, etc isn't the same kettle of fish as trying to
browbeat the userbase into joining their service or lose all manner of
contact with Atari. I'm liking GEnie and their attitude less and less all
the time.
Harkens back a few years when I cancelled my subscription to CI$ over
very similiar circumstances.
I sure hope Atari knows that Atarians as a group are non-conformers who
don't follow the crowd or buy into something just because it's the most
popular. We're much more discriminating in our choices. We aren't
lemmings waiting to follow the gang over the cliff. The more someone
tells me they are the "Best" the more I realize that they aren't the
"Best" for me.
When you're at the top you forget how you got there, what it felt like
being stomped on by the top dogs as you tried to climb up. Basically you
just get complacent and forget about what got you to the top. I'll take
someone in the middle of the pack every time. They try harder, and
generally treat you nicer. Microsoft is the #1 software company, while
the CodeHeads probably aren't in the top 100. I'd MUCH rather deal with
the CodeHeads, one look at Windoze and it's easy to see Microsoft has lost
touch with reality. :'\
Wayne
48761 16-FEB 21:18 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48722)
From: BIBLINSKI To: OCS
Re-read my message, Oliver. I didn't say it was useless, just of little
real use. I tried running Interlink with MTOS, and I had to type at about
2 cps to get Interlink to accept the input. My typing isn't that good,
but I can get going a bit faster than that! I haven't played that much
with it, but given the incompatibilities of so many programs, and the lack
of memory protection with the 68000, I wouldn't want to trust it most of
the time. (Of course, I only have a beta version of MTOS, I can't say how
the final version will be.)
Besides, I can't deal with the slow speed of the 8mHz when I'm using
Pagestream anyway, so having it even slower would kill me. <G>
--Gordie
48791 17-FEB 07:10 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48761)
From: OCS To: BIBLINSKI
Gordie,
I am currently logged in using my old betatest version of MTOS (which
dates back to March 3, 1992). Of course, Uniterm doesn't work, so I am
using an old version of Rufus (the famous German telecom software). I
don't have any background processes at the moment, and the 6*6 font (for
some reason I don't have a larger one, guess I would need GDOS to get a
readble larger font) slows the screen output down, but I can type as fast
as with Uniterm and single-tasking TOS.
I WANT MTOS!!!!
Oliver
48805 17-FEB 10:20 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48740)
From: OCS To: ABARBIERO
- IF Atari decides to put MTOS out as a GEnie only thing... and nothing
- has been decided... then 7 days on GEnie will not kill anyone.
Are we talking about a 7 days "exclusive distribution period" for Delphi?
Considering that it will probably take me a whole day to download the file
from Delphi (with the slow d/l via Kermit and Internet) I can live with
that. Two months, for example, would be totally unacceptable. Then again,
do you really think that a week is enough to get bug reports and reactions
on those by Atari? After all, MTOS has been betatested for several months
now, and those bugs that haven't been found during that time will hardly
appear in a week.
BTW, please make sure that MTOS is not being uploaded to Delphi in one
large file, otherwise a breakdown of the line to Delphi (happens to me all
the time lately) means that everything downloaded so far is lost. And I
can guarantee you that my line will break down at least once within every
200 KB.
Oliver48815 17-FEB 11:15 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48305)
From: BOBBRO To: WAYNEDUNHAM
Wayne,
Thanks for sharing your opinion with me. I appreciate the time and expense
that you went to do share it with me.
The reality is that we have had, and continue to have, a contractual
arrangement with GEnie. It requires that GEnie be at the forefront of all
of our online activities. As you've no doubt noticed, Delphi is now more
interested in a greater role with Atari as well.
First, you need to understand that the idea that ANY of those file be
uploaded is only under discussion. There are forces that feel that they
should only be sold, not uploaded under any circumstances. Part of the
rationale in my plan to upload to GEnie first, then the other networks is
based on the fact that we share in the revenue generated in the Atari
areas on GEnie. I hope that this will be persuasive in convincing the
management to upload MultiTOS to GEnie, and then to the other networks
once we've generated some dollars from the GEnie uploads.
We don't have similar arrangements with Delphi and CIS. They both give us
free access to support our mutual customers online, but that's it. No
dollars are shared between us. This is an important fact to keep in mind
in our decision making process.
While I respect your opinion, and surely understand your desire to see the
files uploaded on all networks at the same time, it just isn't practical.
If the decision to upload the files is made, it will be on GEnie first,
then after a period of time, the other networks. You will not be denied
access to the files by choosing Delphi. You're access to them will only be
delayed for a period of time (probably a month).
best regards,
Bob Brodie
48847 17-FEB 19:02 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48762)
From: DPJ To: BIBLINSKI
The point is, that you _are_ paying for it, albeit online time rather than
a straight purchase. Why should an Atari user, screaming for support,
have to wait a month (or whatever) to be able to get a file just because
they aren't a user of a particular service? It seems that neither Atari
or GEnie has learned anything from past history on this kind of thing. It
didn't work well for the users before, and it won't this time either.
48834 17-FEB 17:37 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48758)
From: ABARBIERO To: WAYNEDUNHAM
Days weeks or months.... the whole exclusivity thing is moot.
Fortunately or unfortunately Atari and GEnie have a special relationship
with accounts and direct support being transferred. Many other companies
do this and it is not a bad thing. Any time period is still arbitrary as
no one has told me how, where, whom, why, or, when MTOS will be released.
If there are any BUGS in MTOS it will only be BUGS in the sense of product
support and the immediate release information. MTOS has been widely
tested and should work as advertised for everyone with a 030 machine.
It will work on an ST/STe, but the results can be less than stellar :-)
When something as big as MTOS is going to be released, someone out there
will find a way to install, use, run it wrong. The F030 version will be
shipped with the computers, and appropriate documentation will be
included.
IF MTOS is released out on the nets, then naturally the support for it
will not be the same, as there is no pre-printed docs, no dealer from whom
the software was purchased, and all levels of user sophisication to
consider.
The way I look at it, my job it to help get Atari answers on Delphi,
someone else, a while back, got that same job done for GEnie, and in
return allows them to make a buck or two on the service they provide.
Atari wont hurt anyone by this, and I will be excited to see something as
important like MTOS given out for free.... would microsoft do this?
NAH....
Andreas@AEO
48663 15-FEB 20:09 General Information
RE: Lynx ad! (Re: Msg 48318)
From: WAYNEDUNHAM To: MRBURKLEY
Michael,
Because there are those of us like myself, and several others who do get
on multiple services. Many times I've played middle man between a user
here, and a developer or support person over on another network.
We (Atarians) are so fractured a group that simply shouting from the
town square (GEnie) will not reach a major portion of our "tribe". We've
got to send out messengers in all directions (yes, even CI$ I suppose) in
order to get the word out. It's not going to be easy to mainstream the
Atarians back into the fold who've either gone on to other platforms,
(while still owning an Atari), have no dealer/Usergroup/magazine access,
or who've just given up. We need MASS distribution, and only giving Mtos
out via GEnie isn't going to come anywhere close to filling that bill.
(IMHO)
Wayne
48687 16-FEB 01:00 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48651)
From: DAVIDNIELD To: ALL
By the way....
The Falcon 030 is featured in the March 1993 Electronic
Musician magazine. By featured, I mean it is on the info line on the
top of the cover and on the spine! Its only a three page article,
but it is very upbeat. It may not offer you any additional
information; if you have been following the saga online here for the
last -few- months, but I learned a few things. For instance, did you
know that the Falcon has sampling rates which range from 8 kHz to
50kHz ,-but- that it skips the 44.1kHz rate used for CD preparation
and the 48kHz rate used by DAT machines? It seems like a very
strange -feature- to exclude the most useful rates for professional
musicians...(am I right)? Apparently these rates will become
available from third parties who will have to implement the correct
crystals in external hardware devices.
If you see it on the newstands, spend a few minutes and
read the article--or spend the $3.95 and read it at home. It may
become a collector's item....:)
Dave
48694 16-FEB 02:52 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48687)
From: BRYEDEWAARD To: DAVIDNIELD
According to my Falcon Hardware manual, the 44.1 and 48KHz modes are both
supported.
-Bry
48990 18-FEB 23:32 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48902)
From: BRYEDEWAARD To: DAVIDNIELD (NR)
This is what the manual says, it's kinda vague.
The bit clock is taken from from the master clock divided by a
programmable value of 4 to 24 (in increments of 4). The Sample rate is
then the bit rate, divided by 128:
- -> Divide by n -> Bit Rate -> Divide by 128 -> Sample Rate
Since the bit rate is 128 times the sample rate, there is room for eight
16-bit samples per second period.
-
Master Clock Divisor(n) Bit Rate Sample Rate
-----------------------------------------------------
25.175MHz 4 6.29375 MHz 49.17KHz (50KHz)
22.5792MHz 4 5.6448 MHz 44.1KHz (CD)
24.576MHz 4 6.144 MHz 48.0KHz (DAT)
32.000MHz 4 8.000 MHz 62.5KHz
The internal 25.175 MHz clock is used to support STE compatible
50KHz,25KHz and 12.5KHz sound sample rates.
The internal 32MHz clock is useful since it can be used to provide an
8MHz bit rate (or 1MB per sec.) which is the maximum transfer rate for
the DSP SSI interface.
The external clock comes from the DSP connector. It can run up to 32MHz.
Some useful external clock rates are shown below:
22.5792 MHz gives CD rate of 44.1 KHz
24.576 MHz gives DAT rate of 48.0 KHz ..........
This sounds to me like these rates WILL have to be external after
all.
-Bry
About "loyalty" and consumerism.....
48700 16-FEB 04:18 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48456)
From: ATARIO To: NORMW
--> Take a look around, Steve. You, Andreas, Chris and AP7 are the
diehards.
--> Every one else sees Atari with a less enthusiastic view.
I'd say that list above leaves out Oliver, since he at least plans to stay
with Atari and still thinks it's a good machine, and also Gordie, for
obvious reasons. And as for who's "on the other side", I'd say you, Dana,
and Ralph.
--> I have made a lot of friends in this Forum over the last seven years,
--> and we are holding a wake for an old friend...the ST.
If you think the machine is dead, why do you bother to attack it and/or
attempt to kill enthusiasm over its resurrection?
__
(_
__)teve
48725 16-FEB 14:21 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48700)
From: OCS To: ATARIO
> Take a look around, Steve. You, Andreas, Chris and AP7 are the diehards.
> Every one else sees Atari with a less enthusiastic view.
>
> I'd say that list above leaves out Oliver, since he at least plans to
> stay with Atari and still thinks it's a good machine, and also Gordie,
> for obvious reasons. And as for who's "on the other side", I'd say
> you, Dana, and Ralph.
You are right, I still like my Atari, but that doesn't mean I am a
die-hard. I see Atari (the company) with the less enthusiastic view Norm
mentioned. As a matter of fact I never saw them with an enthusiastic
view... all I want is a good computer, and it doesn't really matter if it
is made by Atari, Commodore, or you name it. In other words, I do not
stay with Atari, but with my Atari computer, because the computer still
serves my needs.
There is a difference...
Oliver
48749 16-FEB 19:45 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48700)
From: DPJ To: ATARIO
I think that "diehard" can have a number of connotations. I'll probably
use Atari hardware for as long as I can get one that will continue to
work. But, I'm no longer a "blind" Atari user anymore. I used to think
that Atari could do no wrong and whomever said otherwise, I was ready to
"do battle" with them to prove otherwise. Not any longer. Reality
struck.
On one hand, the diehards are those who will use Atari computers until
they cannot any longer because they aren't available; and there are those
diehards that will continue to blindly praise the machines _and_ Atari
until neither exists any longer. Take your pick. Norm's example were
probably grouped into the second, while yours are in the first. <g>
Dana @ STReport International Online Magazine
48778 16-FEB 23:55 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48749)
From: NORMW To: DPJ
Fair enough, Dana. I have no confidence in the company or its future, but
I have three full-up Atari's in operation here. But I also have two other
computers, and can see no purpose in continuing to design product for the
Atari.
Norm
49025 19-FEB 08:04 General Information
RE: Rumor (Re: Msg 48700)
From: RMARIANO To: ATARIO (NR)
Look Steve, pay careful attention... I am a diehard Atarian. Repeat that
three times and then hear me out. I am a diehard Atarian but I will not
fall into to the trap of telling people in so many words that Atari can do
no wrong or, make myself very, very busy making apologetic statements
every time Atari pulls off another magnanomous PR blunder like this
current issue of the MTOS release. No doubt... I'll be using an Atari for
a very long time. But at the same time, I'll not yield to the pressure,
back room politics, and head games. STReport will continue to point out
_both_ sides of the coin. You see, there is no other side... we are all
folks who enjoy using an Atari. There's simply some of us who refuse
march to the beat of certain blunder drummers and zealots.
Ralph @ STReport International Online Magazine
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